The Stain That Passes for an Heirloom

A discussion between Flannery O'Connor and Tanarive Due


The porch belonged to nobody in particular, which is probably why we ended up on it. A farmhouse outside Milledgeville that had been a bed-and-breakfast and then hadn’t been, its rocker chairs still lined up facing a field of dead cotton like an audience waiting for a show that closed decades ago. The heat was the kind that doesn’t move. It just sits on you. I had brought iced tea in a thermos, which felt insufficient the moment I poured it.

Flannery O’Connor was already seated when I arrived, legs crossed at the ankle, looking at the field with an expression I can only describe as professionally unimpressed. She had a pen behind her ear and a peacock feather — I don’t know where she got it, I didn’t ask — laid across her lap like a scepter. Tanarive Due came up the porch steps a few minutes later, brushing red dust off the hem of her dress, and stood for a moment looking out at that same field before she sat down. She didn’t look unimpressed. She looked like she was reading something written in the dirt that the rest of us couldn’t see.

“This is the right kind of ugly for what we’re doing,” O’Connor said, by way of greeting.

“It’s not ugly,” Due said. “It’s honest. There’s a difference, and the South has never been interested in learning it.”

I said something about the story we were here to discuss — a family road trip, a grandmother, a ruined plantation house — and O’Connor cut me off before I’d finished my second sentence.

“The grandmother is the whole thing,” she said. “You understand that. She’s not a character in the story. She’s the engine. Every wrong turn the family takes is a turn she insisted on, and she insisted on it because she has confused nostalgia with virtue, which is the most dangerous confusion available to a human being and the one the South has made its principal export.”

“I agree she’s the engine,” Due said. “But I want to be careful about whose story this is. Because a grandmother dragging her family to a plantation she romanticizes — that’s a story about white self-deception. And that’s a real story, a necessary one. But if the only Black presence in the narrative is a corrective — someone who exists to show the white family what they refuse to see — then we’ve written a story where Black people are instruments of white education, and I’ve read that story a thousand times and I am tired of it.”

This landed on me like a rock. I had been thinking of Ephraim — the caretaker, the man on the porch — as exactly that. A corrective. A mirror. I said as much, and Due looked at me with a patience that was also a warning.

“A mirror is a piece of furniture,” she said. “Ephraim is a person. He has a grandmother too. She told him things. He carries those things in his body, not in his argument. When he shows that family what’s under the stairs, he’s not teaching them a lesson. He’s performing a ritual his grandmother demanded of him. He’s keeping faith with the dead. The white family’s education is a side effect. It might not even work.”

“It won’t work,” O’Connor said, with a sharpness that sounded almost pleased. “That’s the point. Grace doesn’t arrive as understanding. It arrives as violence. The grandmother will see those names carved in the clay and she will not be transformed. She’ll be cracked open. And what leaks out won’t be wisdom — it’ll be panic, and denial, and a frantic attempt to reassemble the story she’s been telling herself for seventy-eight years. That’s more interesting than redemption. Redemption is a greeting card. What I want is the moment where the lie becomes physically impossible to maintain and the person tries to maintain it anyway.”

I asked if the grandmother could have any genuine recognition at all — even a flicker.

“A flicker is fine,” O’Connor said. “A flicker is actually worse than nothing, because a flicker means she saw and then chose to look away. That’s damnation. Not the absence of grace, but the refusal of it. The refusal is where the horror lives.”

“For you,” Due said. “For you the horror lives in the refusal of grace. For me the horror lives in the fact that Ephraim’s grandmother had to designate a keeper. Had to say to a seven-year-old boy: this is your job now, this terrible knowledge, you hold it, you show it to them when they come back looking for silver. That’s a weight placed on a child’s shoulders by four hundred years of American history, and the grandmother’s refusal to see is secondary to the fact that someone had to stand there holding the door open in the first place.”

There was a silence after that. The cotton field did nothing. A crow went over, dragging its shadow behind it like a thought it couldn’t quite let go of.

“Both,” I said, and O’Connor looked at me like I’d just said something either very young or very stupid.

“Both what?”

“Both horrors. The grandmother’s refusal is one horror and Ephraim’s inheritance is another and they’re not the same horror and they don’t cancel each other out. The story has to hold them both without pretending they’re equal.”

“They’re not equal,” Due said immediately. “Don’t you dare balance them. Ephraim’s people were enslaved. The grandmother’s people did the enslaving. Those are not symmetrical positions and a story that treats them as parallel tragedies is a lie. But you can hold them in the same frame without equating them. What you need is a narrator who sees clearly enough to know the difference.”

“The granddaughter,” O’Connor said. She uncrossed her ankles and recrossed them the other way, which seemed to signify thought. “The granddaughter is your point-of-view. She’s young enough to see what her grandmother can’t. But seeing isn’t the same as doing anything about it. She can witness the names in the clay. She can feel the horror. And then she gets back in the car and drives to Tallahassee. What does her seeing accomplish? Nothing. Not yet. Maybe not ever. And that’s honest too.”

“Jolene,” I said. I’d been thinking of the name.

“Fine,” O’Connor said. “Jolene looks things up on her phone. She finds the census record. Forty-one enslaved persons, listed as numbers. And then she walks into the house and sees the names. The gap between the census and the clay — that’s your story. That’s the distance between a country that recorded people as inventory and the people who insisted on scratching their names into the earth anyway.”

Due leaned forward. “But the names aren’t for Jolene. That’s what I keep coming back to. Those names were carved by people in a punishment cell. They weren’t carving them so that a white girl with an iPhone could feel something two hundred years later. They were carving them because carving your name into a wall when someone has taken everything else from you is an act of survival. Of self-declaration. The names exist for the people who made them. Jolene’s encounter with them is — what’s the word —”

“Incidental,” O’Connor said.

“No. Not incidental. Overdue. But not the point.”

O’Connor took the peacock feather off her lap and pointed it at me like a conductor’s baton. “This is where your story has to be ruthless. The reader will want Jolene’s encounter with the names to mean something. The reader will want transformation. A reckoning. The granddaughter walks into a punishment cell and comes out changed. That’s the sentimental version. The ruthless version is: she comes out changed and it changes nothing. The grandmother still says ‘he was lying’ in the car. The family still drives to Tallahassee. The house still rots. The names are still there, and someone still has to tend them, and it won’t be a Harwick.”

“Ephraim’s not a symbol,” Due said again. I could feel her circling back to this point, pressing on it like a bruise she needed me to acknowledge. “I want him to have a physical life. Mud on his pants. A shirt buttoned to the throat in August. A machete he uses for cutting vines. I want the reader to understand that this man has been doing something every day — physical labor, the work of keeping this ruin from being swallowed — and that this labor is not metaphorical. It’s Tuesday. He got up, he dressed, he went to the house with a machete, and he cut back the wisteria that’s eating the columns. He does this because his grandmother told him to, and because the dead ask things of the living, and the living do them.”

“And when the white family shows up,” I said, “he’s already there. He’s been there. He’s not summoned by their arrival. They’re the interruption.”

Due nodded. “Yes. Exactly. He’s the constant. They’re the variable.”

“The hawk,” O’Connor said suddenly.

We both looked at her.

“Put a hawk on a fence post. Watching the car go by. The hawk’s been there too. The hawk doesn’t care about the Harwicks. The hawk has its own business. But it watches them the way Ephraim watches them — with attention, without investment. The land has its own witnesses. They are not all human.”

I wrote this down. I wrote everything down, but this I underlined, because it felt like something I would forget if I didn’t mark it, the way you mark a place in a book you know you’ll need to return to but can’t explain why.

“Let me ask about the house,” I said. “The wisteria, the collapsed rear wall, the yard coming in. Is the house dying or is the land reclaiming it?”

“Is there a difference?” Due asked.

“Enormous difference,” O’Connor said. “If the house is dying, it’s a tragedy. The fall of a great estate. If the land is reclaiming it, it’s justice. The earth taking back what was stolen. And the grandmother’s entire crisis depends on which version she believes. She sees death. Ephraim sees reclamation. Neither of them is wrong, but they can’t both be right in the same sentence.”

“The wisteria,” Due said. “The wisteria is parasitic but also beautiful. That’s the South. That’s the whole thing. You can’t separate the beauty from the violence. The beauty is the violence. The columns are beautiful and they were built by enslaved people and the wisteria is strangling them and the wisteria is also gorgeous, purple and heavy and sweet-smelling, and it will bring the whole house down in another fifty years, and I’m not sure whether that’s a tragedy or a kindness.”

I said I wanted the story to end with Jolene in the car, looking at her phone, looking at the census record, knowing she’ll come back. And O’Connor shook her head.

“Don’t you dare let her decide to come back. Don’t give her that resolution. You can let her think about coming back. You can let the impulse exist. But the moment she makes a decision, you’ve given the reader a way out. You’ve said: the next generation will fix this. And that’s a lie. That’s the lie Americans have been telling since Reconstruction. ‘The children will be better.’ The children are in the back seat with their earbuds in.”

“Webb,” I said. “The brother. He takes out his earbuds when he sees the names.”

“And then puts them back in,” O’Connor said. “Don’t forget that.”

“But Jolene is different,” I argued. “She looked it up. She already knew about the forty-one people before they got to the house. She was carrying that knowledge.”

“Carrying knowledge and doing something with it are different animals,” Due said. “My people have been carrying knowledge for centuries. The question isn’t whether Jolene knows. The question is whether knowing costs her anything. If it doesn’t cost her anything, it’s tourism.”

That word sat on the porch with us for a while. Tourism. I could feel it pressing against the story I’d been building in my head, testing the load-bearing walls.

“What does Ephraim feel?” I asked. “When the grandmother says ‘I didn’t know’ — and they all know she’s lying — what does he feel?”

“Nothing new,” Due said quietly. “He’s heard it before. His mother heard it. His grandmother heard it. ‘I didn’t know’ is what they always say. It’s not even a lie anymore, it’s a liturgy. A thing white people say at the altar of a history they built and then pretended they found. Ephraim doesn’t feel surprised or angry or vindicated. He feels the specific exhaustion of a man performing a duty that will never be finished because the people it’s performed for will never stop needing to hear it and will never stop refusing to.”

O’Connor was quiet for a moment. The pen behind her ear caught the late sun and threw a little bar of light across her cheek.

“The violence,” she said. “Where’s the violence?”

“The names are the violence,” Due said. “A punishment cell under a staircase. Names scratched in clay by people who were shut in the dark. That’s not metaphorical violence. That’s actual violence echoing forward through time. You don’t need a gun. You don’t need a murder on a dirt road. The violence already happened. It’s just still happening.”

“Hmm,” O’Connor said, which I think was as close as she comes to concession. “The violence already happened. The story is about what’s left after. The residue. The stain.”

“The stain that passes for an heirloom,” I said, not knowing where the phrase came from, and both of them looked at me — O’Connor with one eyebrow raised and Due with something closer to recognition.

“Red clay,” Due said. “You wrote about it. The color of Georgia dirt. Gets into your clothes, your car mats, your history. Does not wash out.”

“Yes,” I said.

“That’s not a metaphor,” she said. “That’s a material fact. Red clay is iron oxide. It’s the same compound that makes blood red. The ground down here is the color of old blood. Every Southerner knows this in their body even if they’ve never thought it consciously. The stain is literal.”

A wasp was building something in the eave above us, working with the dumb persistence of a creature that doesn’t know the porch it’s building on is already condemned. I watched it for a while. Nobody said anything. The cotton field baked. Somewhere behind the house a screen door banged in a wind I couldn’t feel from where I was sitting, and the sound was so perfect — so exactly the sound of a Southern Gothic story announcing itself — that I almost laughed. But the porch wasn’t that kind of porch. The conversation wasn’t that kind of conversation.

“I think the grandmother should say ‘There was silver’ in the car,” I said. “After they leave. Not as denial exactly — more like the last gasp of the story she’s been telling. The story is dying and she’s trying to resuscitate it.”

“‘There was silver and a tea service and the family was respected in this county,’” O’Connor said, testing the line. “Yes. Let her recite the catechism. Let her go down swinging. She won’t change. She can’t. She’s too old and the story is too deep in her bones. But the recitation should sound different now. Hollow. Like a prayer said by someone who’s lost the faith but hasn’t yet learned to stop moving their lips.”

Due stood up. She walked to the edge of the porch and looked out at the field.

“I want Ephraim’s grandmother to have the last word,” she said, without turning around. “Not literally — she’s dead, she can’t speak. But her instruction — let them see it, every time they come back, open that wall — that instruction should be the thing that echoes. Not the grandmother’s denial. Not Jolene’s half-formed resolve. The voice that lasts should be the one that said: keep this wound open. Don’t let them cover it. The refusal to heal as an act of remembrance.”

“That’s not a resolution,” O’Connor said.

“No,” Due said. “It’s not.”

And neither of them seemed bothered by that, which bothered me, which I think was probably the point.